Treenitoikki vuoden 2008 alulle

Knoukka

Well-known member
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25.5.2000
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27426
Olkapää- ja hartiatreeni. Tein jumppamielessä pitkää lämmittävää sarjaa kun oli niskat ihan jumissa. Auttoi. :ahem:
 

Archie

Well-known member
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14.2.2000
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13050
Tajusin tänään, että sateella on kaikkein mukavinta juosta.
 

Jacques

KKWCS:n Mietaa
Liittynyt
15.10.1999
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37046
Sijainti
Helsinki
Ei mitään jakoa 3.45 sakkiin, noutaja tulee satavarmasti. Jos jäniksen mukaan lähdet niin 4.30 tai jotain. Suosittelen läpikahlaustakin oli aika mikä oli mieluummin kuin kovaa ja keskeytys. Saat oppia ja kokemusta- sen että maraton alkaa vasta kolmestakympistä. Siellä sitä sattuu ja tapahtuu sitten. Tsemppiä vaan pirusti, ja tervettä järkeä kipujen kanssa.
Noh.. Mä lähden fiiliksen mukaan menemään.. Tottahan tuo on että kannattaa varmaan lähteä varovasti matkaan kun ei ole ikinä noin pitkää matkaa juossut.. Ja voi sit kerskua juosseensa maratonin. Ajanhan voi jättää sanomatta, jos se on huono. :D
Mut joo, ehkä sitä vois sittenkin aloittaa sieltä lähempää 4:30 jänistä ja edetä pikkuhiljaa kiristäen sen hetkisen päivän kunnon mukaan.
 

Lancer

Realisti
Liittynyt
23.7.2007
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20495
Sijainti
taas Suomessa
Palasin äsken tunnin lenkiltä, joka venyi sitten peräti kolmeen tuntiin kun käännyin muutaman kerran väärään suuntaan :eek::frank:. Ei tee enää mieli lähteä kävelee. :yuck:
 

Sam

Muumipappa
Liittynyt
2.8.2000
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34097
Sijainti
Muumilaakso
Palasin äsken tunnin lenkiltä, joka venyi sitten peräti kolmeen tuntiin kun käännyin muutaman kerran väärään suuntaan :eek::frank:. Ei tee enää mieli lähteä kävelee. :yuck:
Noin käy täälläkin, jos eksyy naapuriin. Silti vaan uudestaan kuntoa kohottamaan...
 

Knoukka

Well-known member
Liittynyt
25.5.2000
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27426
Kevyt tv-kymppi. Olipa kiva ja vaivaton juoksu flunssanpoikasen pakottaman levon jälkeen. Vähän lensi räkä alussa, mutta jalat oli herkässä kunnossa. Aikaa meni 47.20, keskisyke 143bpm ja EPOC 98. Oukei.
 

Mosse

Skidmark
Liittynyt
5.3.1999
Viestit
104235
Sijainti
On earth
Tulipa tehtyä aamusta 'kesän' paras fillarilenkki. Sain, kiitos tehtyjen intervallien, tehoja kivasti irti ja pidettyä tempoa. Pariin tuntiin kelasin 59 kilsaa. Eka 20 km meni 32,24 km/h keskivauhdilla. Sitten tuli noita liikenneongelmia ja vähän väsykin, mutta ihan kiva ja ylämäkiin sai kivasti 'runttia' päälle.:thumbup:

Uintia HALLISSA 64,6 km
Uintia JÄRVESSÄ 2,4 km
KUNTOPYÖRÄÄ 363,5 km
Pyöräilyä ULKONA 482 km
Juoksua MATOLLA 60,2 km
Juoksua ULKONA 175,9 km
Hiihtoa LUONNOSSA 132,1 km
Soutua PUNTTISALISSA SOUTUKONEELLA 161 min 36 km
Punttisali 12,5 h
Rullaluistelua 18,4 km
 

Jacques

KKWCS:n Mietaa
Liittynyt
15.10.1999
Viestit
37046
Sijainti
Helsinki
9.8.
Juoksua 20min ja 3km. Jaloissa vielä tuntui torstain pitkä lenkki, joten tein vain palauttavan lyhyen lenkin. Keskisyke 131.

10.8.
Pyöräilyä 1h 26min ja 38km.. Keskisyke 150 ja tuollaista kevyttä polkemista koko matka. Vähän paikkojen availua eikä mitään erikoisempaa.

Saldo 2008:
Sali: 47h 10min
Pyöräily: 2857km / 108h 49min
Juoksu: 399,9km / 37h 56min
Sauvakävely: 25,5km / 3h45min
Hiihto: 103km / 8h15min
Uinti: 6,7km / 5h15min
Rullaluistelu: 18km / 1h15min
 

7son7

Well-known member
Liittynyt
5.11.2004
Viestit
610
Laitetaan tama juttu tanne Jaqille luettavaksi maratonia varten. Hyvaa juttua The Wallista ja mika sen aiheuttaa ja mita sille pystyy tekemaan. Luultavasti monet jo tietaa taman jutun, mutta eipa sen lukemisesta mitaan haittaakaan ole. Kirjoittaja on tohtori-seta ja hanen PR on 3:45.

Fuel for the Run, Fuel for the Race

Running is one of the most efficient ways to burn stored calories. As we begin to ramp up through marathon training season, let’s consider how your body stores and uses calories to fuel your runs, and what the limits are for using these energy stores. In this discussion, I will use the abbreviation kCal to represent calories. When you look at the nutrition information on your food, the calories it reports are actually kilocalories (i.e., 1000 calories), but it is simplified for consumers. In this discussion, I will use the more accurate kCal.

I will also refer to percentages of your “maximum effort”. Your maximum effort is about the effort required to achieve your maximal heart rate or to calculate your VO2Max. This is about the same effort you would use to run your fastest 200-400 meter interval run following an adequate warm up.

This discussion does not account for hydration, caffeine or electrolytes, as they are independent topics that merit their own consideration.

Energy Sources

Your body uses two energy stores to fuel the run: glycogen and fat. Glycogen is your body’s form of stored carbohydrates, sugars and starches. Glycogen is the primary energy source used for fight or flight type activities, which means it is the primary energy source used when running hard. When you run above 80-90% of your maximum effort, your body is burning almost entirely glycogen to fuel the effort. Below that, your body starts using the second energy source, which is fat. An inaccurate but useful rule of thumb is that your body fuels its effort using glycogen as a percentage of total calories used that is equivalent to your percent effort. So if you are running at a 70% effort, about 70% of the kCal you are using to fuel the effort are coming from glycogen, and the rest come from fat. Running on fat stores works very well, but fat burning is less efficient than glycogen burning, so you have to run more slowly.

The human body can contain a maximum of about 2000 kCal of stored glycogen. Glycogen is the energy source we use when we run. Your body stores glycogen in the muscles and in the liver. Most of us burn about 100-140 calories for every mile we run, which means that when running hard, we will run out of glycogen after about 16-18 miles if you start out with full glycogen stores. After you run out of glycogen, your body will force you to stop as you transition from burning glycogen to burning protein (i.e., your leg muscles). Once your body has transitioned, you can run again, albeit more slowly. This transition can be very difficult or painful, and is often referred to as “bonking” or “hitting the wall”.

While your body can hold a maximum of about 2000 kCal of energy stored as glycogen, it holds another 4000 kCal for EVERY pound of fat you have (e.g., a 150 lb person with just a 5% body fat will still have almost 8 lbs of fat, worth about 32 000 kCal). Energy expenditure while running is a function of your weight, and to a lesser extent the grade of the road, and to a far lesser extent to your pace. So an 8 minute per mile runner burns energy at about the same rate PER MILE WHILE RUNNING as a 12 minute per mile runner who has the same weight. A 150 lb runner will burn approximately 120 kCal per mile run.

Your Energy Limits

As above, the reason you bonk in a run is that you run out of glycogen. If you weigh 150 lbs and are running above 80% effort, you will use about 2000 kCal worth of glycogen in about 21 miles. If you are running at a 70% effort, it will take you 24 miles to use 2000 kCal worth of glycogen. So why do you bonk at mile 16 or 18? Well, even if you carb load absolutely perfectly (and most of us do not), when you finish loading, you then go to bed and sleep. When you wake up marathon morning, your body has used up as much as 25-30% of your glycogen just keeping you alive overnight. And the next morning, the little bit you are able to force down into your stomach, well it does not ever get a chance to be stored as glycogen. Go out too fast and you will burn predominantly glycogen relative to fat and use up your stores more quickly.

In general, the more you run in your life, the more efficient you get at burning glycogen at a given pace. This is based on total lifetime miles, total weekly miles and total quality miles. People who have run distance for years, and who put in 40-60+ miles per week use and replace glycogen more efficiently than folks who have only been running for a short time and who can only put in 20-30 miles per week or less. The more efficiently you burn glycogen, the less quickly you use it up, and the further you can go at a given speed and effort. Your genetic makeup may also play a role in your glycogen efficiency.

Extending your Fuel

Taking in calories during the run can extend this by preserving some of the glycogen that is stored in your liver. A packet of energy gel has about 100 calories (worth just under a mile of running) and a 4 ounce cup of a standard sports drink has about 8 calories (about 50-100 yards). Of course, you may actually get fewer calories than this if you don’t consume the entire gel packet or your sports drink is mixed to a dilute concentration.

When you run hard and approach your maximum possible effort, your body cannot digest well. This is primarily because your blood is pumped away from your gut and to your muscles. In this situation, even energy gels can be hard to digest. At a true 5k effort of ~90% of your maximal effort, you should have trouble digesting even water or sports drinks. At a true marathon effort of ~70-80% of your maximum effort, you should be able to tolerate candies, simple carbohydrates and fluids, although you may have more trouble with some than with others. At an ultramarathon effort or a walk, you should be able to tolerate and may even crave more complex foods such as candy, potatoes, PB&J, soft drinks, etc. All of this requires trial and error. There is also a limitation to how quickly your body can absorb the calories that you consume. I understand that the ceiling is about 3-400 kCal per hour during exercise, while most of us burn 5-800 kCal per hour depending on weight, pace and ambient temperature.

If you feel you need energy supplementation on training runs, you should be able to take in any simple carbohydrate source. Energy gels are good if you want something portable. I personally prefer Little Debbie Oatmeal Pies or Star Crunch bars. I will also occasionally have a nut/granola bar, a banana or banana bread. I usually only have these during the run if I am running over 14ish miles, although I often run miles easy with no calories on the run other than a few cups of sports drink (~<50 kCals worth total). If you are bonking on your marathon training runs, you may be running them too hard and/or you are not taking in enough calories in your daily life.

When to start supplementing your stores by consuming energy sources on course is really a matter of personal style and experience. The manufacturers of these products always recommend that you take some before exertion and then every 30-45 minutes during ongoing exertion. Of course, they are selling a product and want to sell more. Many marathons offer energy gels around midway and in the last quarter of the race. If you carry your own, you can take them when it is convenient to you, and you can always grab several packets during the race and save them for later. I usually try to space mine regularly rather than wait until my energy is waning, but others wait until they need that extra boost in the final miles. Try it in training and on your long runs and find out what works best for you.

An Example

Playing with the math, we find the following. Assuming that you weigh 150 lbs (thereby burning 120 kCal per mile), that you are running your marathon at 75% effort, and that you are able to store 2000 kCal, but that you also slept during the night and burned 25% of those calories, but that you take enough energy gel and sports drink to get 2 extra miles:

((2 000 kCal glycogen * (1 - 0.25 burned last night)) / (120 kCal per mile * .75 effort)) + 2 miles from carbs on the course = 18.6 miles

You will bonk at mile 18.6. Or so. It is never quite this predictable. You can also attenuate this by long-term training (which increases your total body glycogen storage abilities and improves your fat burning at high exertion over time).

Pithy Quote

Tim Noakes, an internationally renowned running physiologist, described the body’s limits well in his, The Lore of Running. Among many other things, he writes:

"The marathon is less a physical event than a spiritual encounter. In infinite wisdom, God built into us a 32 km racing limit, a limit imposed by inadequate sources of the marathoner's prime racing fuel -- carbohydrates. But we, in our infinite wisdom, decreed that the standard marathon be raced over 42 km...So it is in that physical no-man's-land, which begins after the 32 km mark, that is the irresistible appeal of the marathon lies. It is at this stage, as the limits to human running endurance are approached, that the marathon ceases to be a physical event...It is there that you learn something about yourself and your view of life." (Noakes, The Lore of Running, p596)

Putting it Together

So, how do you use this information to ensure that you avoid running out of stored energy during your goal race? There are several things to keep in mind, based on what I have just presented. These include:
 

7son7

Well-known member
Liittynyt
5.11.2004
Viestit
610
1. Know your pace ability and run it – running too hard for your body’s abilities and training level will favor glycogen burning, and can cause you to use your stores too quickly. Your abilities relate to your race specific training and your innate potential, and they manifest in how your body handles its energy stores as you run. You can determine your pace ability by running shorter races during the same training cycle and extrapolating from them; e.g., do not start your marathon at your recent 10k pace.

2. Start your race with a full tank - make sure that you eat adequately in the days leading up to your goal race, favoring carbohydrate rich foods and consuming approximately 125-150% of your normal baseline daily intake. In the final 12 hours before your race, eat several easily digested small meals made up of simple carbohydrates and fats.

3. Know your in-race fueling strategy – make sure that if you plan to take in calories while running your race, you have experimented with this process and know what works for you. If you prefer a specific energy gel, carry it with you or select a race that offers it.

4. Loose weight - the less you weigh, the more slowly you will burn your stored glycogen and the longer you will be able to run before transitioning to a fat-burning pace. If you have weight to loose, work on loosing it, especially before your training cycle begins.

5. Expect the unexpected – even if you do everything correctly, run in your abilities and have taken in adequate nutrition, you may still crash. This could be due to unexpected climatic conditions that divert some of your energy stores to handle, such as cold or wind or rain or big hills. You will need a backup plan, which may include slowing your pace, changing your race goals, increasing your on-course calorie consumption or even dropping from the race and refocusing on another.

Part II - running a marathon without fuel

At the dawn of modern marathoning, runners did not drink even water and certainly took no calories. In well under 3 hours.

Now, we all do, in fact, perform better than we would without fluid and calories. A lot is marketing, but it is clear that running AT or ABOVE our appropriate marathon effort uses more calories than most of us store, and causes us to sweat to a point of dehydration, both of which can reduce performance. However, running at a lower effort (or even walking), you can go on nearly forever on the fuel you carry in your fat stores and with just a little rehydration and occasional salt if you are sweating. I am a 3:50 marathoner (until I set my next real PR), but I jogged and racewalked a marathon in April during Passover with very little fluid, almost no prerace carb load and almost no carbs on the course.

This is because when you perform at a lower effort, you use mainly fat (rather than glycogen) and your fat will fuel you to go about 30-40 miles per pound of fat. Weigh 150 lbs and have 6% fat? That will carry you about 400 miles without the need for any additional fuel. But you have to go slow relative to your abilities. JK and I ran a 42 miler with just some gatorade and a candy bar, running and racewalking hills at an overall pace of about 90 second per mile slower than our marathon pace.
 

Teukka

Jarnapoliisi
Liittynyt
4.8.2000
Viestit
13740
Sijainti
Jarnapolis
Mukava kymppi eilen. Hyva hiki ja rullasi.

Treenivinkki!

Kannattaa vetaa edellisiltana 0.75l pullo makeaa valkoviinia ja puoli pakkaa rookia. Kulkee hienosti.
 

Mosse

Skidmark
Liittynyt
5.3.1999
Viestit
104235
Sijainti
On earth
Kesän jälkeen aloitin uimahallikauden. 2 x 1 km veto ykköstä. Toinen pullareilla.

Uintia HALLISSA 66,6 km
Uintia JÄRVESSÄ 2,4 km
KUNTOPYÖRÄÄ 363,5 km
Pyöräilyä ULKONA 482 km
Juoksua MATOLLA 60,2 km
Juoksua ULKONA 175,9 km
Hiihtoa LUONNOSSA 132,1 km
Soutua PUNTTISALISSA SOUTUKONEELLA 161 min 36 km
Punttisali 12,5 h
Rullaluistelua 18,4 km
 

Knoukka

Well-known member
Liittynyt
25.5.2000
Viestit
27426
Tasavauhtinen tunti, footpodista loppu patteri. 12 kilsaa ja risat tuli matkaa. Kyllä päivän kiipeily tikkailla ja tellingeillä tuntuu vielä illalla jaloissa. Mut ihan jees.
 

Jacques

KKWCS:n Mietaa
Liittynyt
15.10.1999
Viestit
37046
Sijainti
Helsinki
12.8.
Juoksua 5km ja 35min.. Lönköttelyvauhdilla vedin herkistelyä. Muutama vähän rivakampi osuus, mutta kuitenkin siten, että maximisyke jäi 160 tasolle. Keskisyke 138.
Päälle hyvät venyttelyt ja kylmä suihku. Nyt on jotenkin rento olo.

Saldo 2008:
Sali: 47h 10min
Pyöräily: 2857km / 108h 49min
Juoksu: 404,9km / 38h 31min
Sauvakävely: 25,5km / 3h45min
Hiihto: 103km / 8h15min
Uinti: 6,7km / 5h15min
Rullaluistelu: 18km / 1h15min


Edit: Siirretäänpäs keskustelu syystreenitoikkiin :ahem:
 
Viimeksi muokattu:

Knoukka

Well-known member
Liittynyt
25.5.2000
Viestit
27426
Kauhee käsitreeni. Ekaks hapat, lopuks ojentajat eli päinvastoin kuin yleensä. Ihan poltoille vedin ja hiki lens. Nyt on pumppis.
 
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